version de linux

Ronald wrote in message <pan.2004.12.14.15.38.00.978715@reply.to>:

Je pense le contraire, je ne sais pas si c'est du au fait que j'ai été
un utilisateur de windows pire que de base avant d'utiliser linux, mais
je trouve préférable que les différences entre les systèmes soient
affichées d'entrée et très prononcée, essayer de ressembler à windows
à tout prix risque de perturber le novice plus qu'autre chose, en le
laissant faussement penser qu'il peut agir ou doit agir de la même façon
en se laissant guider par le système au lieu d'en acquérir le contrôle.
Je dérive vers le débat là et il me semble que le sujet a déjà été
évoqué, mais je pense que la première expérience de l'utilisateur se
fait au travers de l'interface et des logiciels, si en surface tout est
semblable la première réaction peut être de se dire que c'est aussi
pareil à l'intérieur.

Je suis plutôt d'accord, et j'ai d'ailleurs déjà défendu la même position.
Et puis il ne faut pas exagérer : dillo, à part qu'il ne gère pas les
feuilles de style, s'utilise comme n'importe quel navigateur graphique, et
links, bien qu'en mode texte, possède un menu cliquable à la souris. Ce
n'est pas non plus comme si on conseillait netcat pour le web, et ed pour
taper du texte.

Dans un premier temps, l'apprentissage de l'utilisation d'applications
différentes est à mon avis un investissement bien plus important. Plus tard,
il pourra en plus optimiser son installation pour gagner encore en confort,
mais dans un processus d'apprentissage, ça vient plus tard.

Et puis c'est bien gentil, Gnome plus OpenOffice à 70 Mo, mais ça fait
toujours 8 Mo de plus que ce que la machine a (64, moins 2 pour le noyau),
donc ça va quand même pas mal râmer de toutes façons. J'utilise
régulièrement une machine similaire au niveau des performances (le disque
dur est deux fois plus gros, parce que quand le précédent a lâché on n'en
trouvait pas à moins de 20 Go, mais sur les autres points c'est identique),
et une Debian Sarge out of the box fonctionne parfaitement du point de vue
de la vitesse, avec quasiment uniquement des paquets natifs (j'ai recompilé
Vim pour des raisons de termcap foireuse). Évidemment, c'est sans Gnome ni
OpenOffice.

On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 16:10:28 +0100, TiChou wrote:

Dans le message <news:_ACvd.98214$ha.94439@news.chello.at>,
*françois* tapota sur f.c.o.l.configuration :

Il faut, sur un Athlon 1800, pour compiler KDE qui est, sous Linux, le
programme le plus long à compiler avec OOo, environ 8H. Xorg prend
environ 1H. Firefox idem. OOo entre 10 et 12H. Gnome 3H. Bref, en partant
d'un stage 1 sur ce type de machine il faut compter une journée pour
avoir un système complet.

Une petite question:

sur ce genre de machine lancer plusieurs compilation en même temps
(qui ne dépendent pas les uns des autres), apporte un gain de temps ou pas
(avec suffisament de mémoire)? .

En principe, on devrait utiliser l'option '-j' de make, qui permet de
définir le nombre de « jobs » simultanés. La règle pour définir la valeur de
cette option est simple : nombre de processeurs + 1. Sur un mono processeur
on aura donc '-j 2', sur un bi-processeur on aura '-j 3' et ainsi de suite.
On observe alors un réel gain dans les temps de compilation. Par contre, on
ne gagne plus rien à mettre une valeur supérieure que celle définit par la
règle du cpu+1, on risque même de perdre en performance voir d'étouffer
totalement le système avec un nombre important de « jobs ».

Avec un petit bémol: il vaut mieux n'utiliser que les packages stables
car l'utilisation de -j <n> avec n > 1 rend le debug à peu près
impossible. C'est, à mon avis, un bug de make que de ne pas ramener de
façon claire les messages d'erreur en fin de log (en -j 2, les logs
s'entrelacent, l'horreur absolue...). Un autre bug est que les
dépendances sont parfois mal gérées ce qui fait que pour certains
packages la compilation en -j2 est plus longue que en -j1 car make essaye
de faire toutes les targets 2 fois ! Ce qui, dans le pire des cas, revient
à compiler 2 fois l'appli. Là, c'est très clairement un bug de make,
qui ne se souvient pas qu'il est déjà passé... J'ai observé ce
phénomène de nombreuses fois, sur plusieurs architectures (x86, x86_64,
ppc et ppc64), et avec plusieurs versions différentes de make, c'est donc
un bug générique.

[...]

Zanton wrote in message <41bf22b4$0$19274$626a14ce@news.free.fr>:

simon 2252 0.0 0.1 2800 1360 ? S 17:34 0:00 /bin/sh
/usr/local/bin/firefox-installer/firefox

Ca signifie que ça me prend 0.1% de mémoire ? C'est tout ?

Oui. Mais comme tu peux le lire, c'est le script de lancement. Recommence
avec firefox-bin, tu vas déchanter.

simon@Hades:~$ ps u -C firefox-bin
USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TTY STAT START TIME COMMAND
simon 2312 2.6 3.6 102908 33212 ? Sl Dec14 0:33
/usr/local/bin/simon@Hades:~$ ps u -C thunderbird-bin
USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TTY STAT START TIME COMMAND
simon 2337 0.4 3.1 102540 28884 ? Sl Dec14 0:05
/usr/local/bin/

Ca reste correct quand meme :)

--
Zanton

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